[blackshoe]

I appreciate Rik's apology. Thank you Rik. I do not appreciate Alex's trolling.

[AlexJonson]

 blackshoe, on 2012-January-15, 16:14, said:

I appreciate Rik's apology. Thank you Rik. I do not appreciate Alex's trolling.

I've been following this thread - and in the rare position of agreeing with everything Sven and Vampyr say.

So I was genuinely interested in Trinidad's posts and his change of position.

I do think it is amusing in context for you to say I'm trolling, and should I care what you 'appreciate' blackshoe?

[Trinidad]

 AlexJonson, on 2012-January-15, 14:06, said:

Why?

For thinking what I thought about him.

Rik

[blackshoe]

 AlexJonson, on 2012-January-15, 17:23, said:

I've been following this thread - and in the rare position of agreeing with everything Sven and Vampyr say.

So I was genuinely interested in Trinidad's posts and his change of position.

I do think it is amusing in context for you to say I'm trolling, and should I care what you 'appreciate' blackshoe?

Okay, you weren't trolling. Fine. Looked like you were to me. As for your "should I care", it's generally a good idea to be civil in forums, particularly when talking to a moderator.

[gnasher]

 blackshoe, on 2012-January-15, 20:11, said:

it's generally a good idea to be civil in forums, particularly when talking to a moderator.

Why "particularly when talking to a moderator"? It seems to me that incivility to a moderator should have no greater consequences than incivility to anyone else.

[jvage]

 pran, on 2012-January-13, 07:55, said:

If my RHO fails to produce STOP when required I usually do not bother:
I may call immediately if I have nothing to think about, I spend up to ten seconds if I need it.

Our regulation gives me the right to delay my call up to ten seconds regardless of any STOP by RHO when STOP is required. It gives me the right to call at any earlier time unless STOP is in force when I call.

If the mood at the table calls for it I may make a friendly comment that "you should have used STOP here".

Do I have any problem with this? NO!

When as TD I am called to a table because of alleged BIT in a situation where STOP is required I first of all ascertain whether STOP was indeed used.
If not my ruling will usually be "no rectification" unless the BIT is shown to having been really excessive.

I expect this to have the beneficial side-effect that the players will be more observant on the STOP regulation in the future.

Since some posters seems to like Svens practice maybe I should not comment, but his description is not quite consistent with our Norwegian regulations (as a member of our national laws commision I am partly responsible for these).

He is correct that the regulations place the main responsibilty on the stop-bidder. But he failed to mention that the regulation then says (my shortened translation): "Correct tempo is to wait 10 seconds. A significantly shorter or longer pause than 10 seconds may be considered to transmit UI even if the Stop-procedure has not been followed by the stop-bidder."

Sven is correct that the TD is very seldom (never?) called because of too fast calls when the Stop-procedure has not been followed, but as a player who knows the laws and regulations better than most I would not have expected him to call immediately, and even recommend this practice. Personally (and most experienced players actually seems to do the same) I try to always take a short break after a stop-bid. I may however admit that this pause will sometimes be closer to 5 than 10 seconds if the stop-card has not been used and I have no problem...

John

[pran]

 jvage, on 2012-January-16, 06:09, said:

Since some posters seems to like Svens practice maybe I should not comment, but his description is not quite consistent with our Norwegian regulations (as a member of our national laws commision I am partly responsible for these).

He is correct that the regulations place the main responsibilty on the stop-bidder. But he failed to mention that the regulation then says (my shortened translation): "Correct tempo is to wait 10 seconds. A significantly shorter or longer pause than 10 seconds may be considered to transmit UI even if the Stop-procedure has not been followed by the stop-bidder."

Sven is correct that the TD is very seldom (never?) called because of too fast calls when the Stop-procedure has not been followed, but as a player who knows the laws and regulations better than most I would not have expected him to call immediately, and even recommend this practice. Personally (and most experienced players actually seems to do the same) I try to always take a short break after a stop-bid. I may however admit that this pause will sometimes be closer to 5 than 10 seconds if the stop-card has not been used and I have no problem...

John

I must admit that I have overlooked that particular clause (enhanced by me above) within our 2-page long regulation on STOP. I had to look it up and found it in a paragraph rather "far later" from the paragraph first specifying a 10 seconds pause and placing the responsibility on the stop-bidder. (Not an excuse, but possibly an explanation.)

And I have never experienced (or even heard of) a situation where no hesitation or a long hesitation after a failure to provide a required STOP has resulted in any rectification unless there has been a hesitation in the order of a minute or more.

[gwnn]

 gnasher, on 2012-January-16, 03:12, said:

Why "particularly when talking to a moderator"? It seems to me that incivility to a moderator should have no greater consequences than incivility to anyone else.

It seems to me you are right, but so is blackshoe. It should not have greater consequences but in practice they do - moderators are humans who have feelings too and who are subjective too. So in practice it is a good idea to be more courteous to a moderator than a non-moderator because the (unwritten) standards for civility are likely to be more strict for moderators.

[AlexJonson]

 blackshoe, on 2012-January-15, 20:11, said:

Okay, you weren't trolling. Fine. Looked like you were to me. As for your "should I care", it's generally a good idea to be civil in forums, particularly when talking to a moderator.

I agree blackshoe, but when the moderator is acting in that role. When the moderator is just posting opinions, I don't see that they have special privileges to comment without response.

[blackshoe]

Generally speaking, I welcome responses to my posts — if they're civil.