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the mean of this 3 h

#1 User is offline   patroclo 

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Posted 2012-March-20, 01:10

Tell me what cards may have my partner, Only a strong hand, a strong hand with spade,Is he showng a control in h? Is he showing a void or a single with a splinter? If he has spade why is not more simple to bid 2 3 o 4 spade.tks gigi
1H-1S-2H-3H
And after this do i rebid spade? Do i tell another suit if i have? do i cue bid my control?
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#2 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2012-March-20, 01:43

My partner would be showing an invitational hand with 4+ spades and 2 hearts.

I'm not sure that I understand your second question. If I bid 3 after 1 1 2 3 I would be accepting the invitation, showing 6, 3 and asking partner to chose game.
Highly unlikely, but if I bid another suit it would be a cue, accepting the game invitation in 's and looking for slam. It is highly unlikely that I would cue bid here as partner has only shown an invitational hand and
I have limited my hand (11-15) by bidding 2.


edit: unless the auction is a competitive auction in which case the above is total nonsense :lol:
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#3 User is offline   patroclo 

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Posted 2012-March-20, 06:27

i.m speakin only for the pair that is bidding in spade
After to have bid 1 spade on reply to 3h. What is the behaviour?
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#4 User is offline   Codo 

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Posted 2012-March-20, 07:29

So it was a contested auction?
Okay, now you have different ways to raise spades. It is quite usual to use the jumps in spades as weak to preempt the bidding. But if you do so, you need a way to show a good raise. The cuebid of opponents suit is used for this normally. So 3 from partner showed a good hand with spade support, he has at least invitational values. So if you accept the invitation, you bid 4 spade, else 3 Spade.
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#5 User is offline   daveharty 

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Posted 2012-March-20, 07:44

My interpretation of the OP is that the following auction is in question (consider this another plea to use the hand editor):



And the OP is wondering about the meaning of 3. If that is the case, then the question is an important one: if advancer (West in my example diagram; a fancy word for the partner of the overcaller) has spades, why did she bid hearts instead of spades? The answer lies in the need for a way to differentiate between different strengths of spade raises. Think about these three immediate spade raises that West could make rather than bidding 3H: 2, 3, and 4. The meaning of the first is similar to what it would have been if partner had opened, rather than overcalled: 6-9 points with 3-card spade support. The second, however, is often played as a weak, preemptive action, what I have seen some people call a "blocking" bid. So what are we to do when we have a good hand with support for partner's overcall? We could just bid 4 immediately, but if partner's overcall could have a fairly wide range, that might land us in a silly spot if partner is on the low end for her bid. Therefore 4 is usually played as a different hand type: again a "preemptive" action, but with more trumps and playing strength than 3.

So this leaves us needing a way to show a good spade raise. And this is what the cuebid is normally used for in a competitive auction: to show a strong (10+) raise of overcaller's suit. This allows the overcaller to show a minimum overcall by simply rebidding 3, or, with a hand that would accept a game invitation, to bid 4. If overcaller rebids 3, the ball is back in advancer's court; she will normally pass, but with a really good hand she can bid 4 herself (maybe she was interested in a slam if partner had a non-minimum overcall). This way both partners are involved in the decision about how high the partnership goes.

EDIT: Apologies to Codo who said much of the same stuff in the time it was taking me to be long-winded.
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#6 User is offline   patroclo 

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Posted 2012-March-20, 10:08

thanks to all for exposition
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#7 User is online   P_Marlowe 

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Posted 2012-March-20, 10:09

Invitational strength with a heart fit.

Since 2H showed a 6 card suit, partners 3H bid may be based on a doubleton.

If you ask for follow ups, better provide an example hand.

With kind regards
Marlowe
With kind regards
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#8 User is offline   neilkaz 

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Posted 2012-March-20, 11:24

I don't want to sound like the forum cop, but if the OP always takes the time to use hand diagrams as Dave did in his very nice post/explanation, there's much less chance for confusion. This means that the "noise" in reponse is less since people aren't guessing as to what the OP is asking and also means that people are less likely to become disinterested in the thread.
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