[hrothgar]

---

IMPS
South is Dealer

Please

1. Recommend a final contract
2. Propose an auction

[ggwhiz]

1♠ (never gets passed out in my neck of the woods)

2♠ (constructive, 8-10) ain't happening if you play Bergen

3♦ a "fake" help suit

If pard bids game, pass opposite wastage but if they sign off, bid slam. With my pard, if Im south I'm in slam or north we're in game.

[JLOGIC]

1S 2S
3C 4S
P

[mikeh]

1♠ 3♣ bergen 4 card constructive


S can maybe essay a slam try but it seems against the odds: if we have no spade loser, we rate to have club issues, and possibly a heart problem.

ATT, I'd bid 3♥, ostensibly a game try. Partner has soft values, and poor trump, but has heart help. It's close: but playing heavy invites and aggressive acceptance, N would bid 4♠. This denies a good hand with a club control, since he could bid 4♣ along the way. I don't mind cuing Kings here, but not with a minimum.

Opener now needs magic cards, since if N has a club control, he hates his hand despite bidding game. So I think S passes.

I also think that it would be easy for N-S to get too high here.

Of course, slam might fetch, but we don't want to be there: it is less than 50%, requiring not only the trump hook, but a decent break and no club overruff.

[hrothgar]

I am beginning to sense a theme here.

It is one that suggests that

1. My decision to stretch a 2♣ was a mistake (still trying to figure out why I did it)
2. A final contract of 6SXX should not be considered a thing of beauty

[ArtK78]

I don't think that this hand is a difficult hand. The final contract should be 4♠ (12 tricks requires a great deal of good luck), and the only task seems to be to avoid getting too high.

Pessimistic auction: 1♠ - 2♠ - 4♠.

More likely, South will make some sort of "game" try, meaning it as a slam try, as he will carry on to game regardless of what North does. What does South need to make a slam? AKxxx of clubs in the North hand is very likely to be sufficient. KJ of clubs and the ♠K may be enough, as North's heart losers (if any) can be thrown away on South's clubs if the total number of North's cards in the rounded suits is 6 or less.

If South makes a game try in clubs and North cooperates, South may want to risk RKCB to determine if North has the ♠K. He can only be certain if North also has the ♣A, so using RKCB leaves something to be desired. However, if the partnership plays trump cue bids, a series of cue bids attempting to endplay North into cuebidding the ♠K might work.

I suspect that the safest course is to settle for game and to avoid the risk of getting too high. You need very specific cards in the context of a single raise (or even a mixed raise) for slam to be a good bet.

[ArtK78]

hrothgar, on 2013-March-04, 10:30, said:

I am beginning to sense a theme here.

It is one that suggestions that

1. My decision to stretch a 2♣ was a mistake (still trying to figure out why I did it)
2. A final contract of 6SXX should not be considered a thing of beauty

I agree with both of these points. However, +1620 is a thing of beauty (-200 or -600, not so much).

[Fluffy]

south has 2 options over 2♠: bid 4♦ or bid 3♣. If he bids 3♣ he might reach 5♠ slam after north colaborates and checks 2 keycards are missing. 4♦ will quickly remove that posibility.

[Codo]

If you do nt open 2 ♣, you may play 1 ♠ in many places. And if you take partners hand you have play in 4 ♠, even if he possesses no honours at all. So, 2 ♣ is not the worst mistake ever.
But anyway, 1 ♠ is of course the usual opening,which will take you to 4 ♠- a goal you should have reached with 2 ♣ too.

[JLOGIC]

ArtK78, on 2013-March-04, 10:31, said:

I don't think that this hand is a difficult hand. The final contract should be 4♠ (12 tricks requires a great deal of good luck), and the only task seems to be to avoid getting too high.

Pessimistic auction: 1♠ - 2♠ - 4♠.

More likely, South will make some sort of "game" try, meaning it as a slam try, as he will carry on to game regardless of what North does. What does South need to make a slam? AKxxx of clubs in the North hand is very likely to be sufficient. KJ of clubs and the ♠K may be enough, as North's heart losers (if any) can be thrown away on South's clubs if the total number of North's cards in the rounded suits is 6 or less.

If South makes a game try in clubs and North cooperates, South may want to risk RKCB to determine if North has the ♠K. He can only be certain if North also has the ♣A, so using RKCB leaves something to be desired. However, if the partnership plays trump cue bids, a series of cue bids attempting to endplay North into cuebidding the ♠K might work.

I suspect that the safest course is to settle for game and to avoid the risk of getting too high. You need very specific cards in the context of a single raise (or even a mixed raise) for slam to be a good bet.

FWIW I bid 3C planning on only going slamming if partner gave me 4C. Compared to bidding 4S immediately I think that is a superior strategy, if partner has a good club FIT you are much more likely to have a slam.

[hrothgar]

ArtK78, on 2013-March-04, 10:36, said:

I agree with both of these points. However, +1620 is a thing of beauty (-200 or -600, not so much).

FWIW, the slam did score up.

I'm still not sure why since I am normally a conservative 2♣ opener, but I decided to start with a 2♣ opening leading to the following

2C - (P) - 2D - (P)
2S - (P) - 3S - (P)
4D - (X) - P - (P)
4H - (P) - 6S - (P)
P - (X) - XX - All pass

[Fluffy]

for me 4♥ denied a first round control in diamonds, though it was standard.

[Free]

I'd end up in 4♠ or 5♠ depending on whether we RKC or not. This is a clear 1♠ opener imo.

[rmnka447]

Although I very often open 4 loser hands 2 ♣, my gut feel on this one was to open 1 ♠.

My auction probably would have been 1 ♠ - 2 ♠ - 4 ♠.

But seeing JLOGIC's explanation of his "game try". I think that's better.

Opening 2 ♣ isn't necessarily wrong with this hand, but just requires some careful bidding.

2 ♣ - 2 ♦ (waiting)

2 ♠ -

3 ♠ -strongest raise 8+ value and Hxx or xxxx in ♠

3 NT (waiting bid slam interest)

4 ♣ - 1st or 2nd round club control

4 NT - 1430

5 ♦ - 0 or 3

5 ♠

If you're going to move towards slam, you should ask yourself what you need to know to ensure slam makes. Here, your concern is with the possibility of 2 Club losers. So you need to get responder to show a Club control. My favorite partner and I have decided that after finding a 8 or 9 card major fit that 3 NT isn't a logical contract. So we use it as a waiting bid initiating cue bidding and denying a Club control. Here, it allows responder to show the Club control. But the subsequent keycard check, reveals 2 losers, so you can stop.

[lalldonn]

I don't agree with 2♣, but after that slam would have been avoided simply by north bidding RKC instead of jumping to slam. For all he knew you were off the trump ace? Like a KQJTxx AK AKJ Qx kind of hand. Also I'll be harsh but honest and say I think the redouble is too awful for words. What are the odds the guy on opening lead would double here and be wrong? If he had the KT9x of spades and club ace that you might expect for this double....

[gszes]

lalldonn, on 2013-March-05, 15:24, said:

I don't agree with 2♣, but after that slam would have been avoided simply by north bidding RKC instead of jumping to slam. For all he knew you were off the trump ace? Like a KQJTxx AK AKJ Qx kind of hand. Also I'll be harsh but honest and say I think the redouble is too awful for words. What are the odds the guy on opening lead would double here and be wrong? If he had the KT9x of spades and club ace that you might expect for this double....

AGREE here wholeheartedly there is a valid use for xx and this is not it. The right time to use the
xx is when your rho x and you have something like KQxx or KJxx trump support. The xx here serves
the purpose of telling p that you have superb trumps and they are not a concern --this information may
keep p from running to a possibly inferior contract becasue they fear trump losers.

[hrothgar]

lalldonn, on 2013-March-05, 15:24, said:

I don't agree with 2♣, but after that slam would have been avoided simply by north bidding RKC instead of jumping to slam. For all he knew you were off the trump ace? Like a KQJTxx AK AKJ Qx kind of hand. Also I'll be harsh but honest and say I think the redouble is too awful for words. What are the odds the guy on opening lead would double here and be wrong? If he had the KT9x of spades and club ace that you might expect for this double....

The redouble was a state of the match / its the last hand / lets go for it redouble

I doubt that the bid would normally have occurred

[Hanoi5]

1♠-3♣
3♦-4♣
4NT-5♦
5♠

[TWO4BRIDGE]

hrothgar, on 2013-March-04, 09:02, said:

---

IMPS
South is Dealer

Please

1. Recommend a final contract
2. Propose an auction

I have a generalised LTC ( Loser Trick Count ) method over lower Bergen.

Lower Bergen ( 7 - 9 hcp ) is either 8 or 9 LTC .
So, Opener with 6 or lower LTC will "ask" using 3D!

Responder replies 3M with 9 or 4M with 8 .

Here, Opener is 4 LTC and Responder is 8 ... slam is possible ( 24-12 = 12 tricks )

But Opener can check for key cards:
1S - 3C!
3D! - 4S
4NT - 5C ( 0/3 )
5S - ?? ( missing 2 key cards; obviously the ♣A and ♠K )

The ♠K is finesse is 50% and the ♣A could be onsides ( 50% if partner does not have the ♣ Q ) .

What is that come to... a 25 % slam ... maybe higher but certainly less than 50%?
So, pass 5S.