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Will poverty ever be history?

#241 User is offline   blackshoe 

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Posted 2014-September-23, 09:05

'The government had the right to demand 99 percent of a man’s property, the Vermont representative thundered. If the nation needs it, “the property of the people . . . belongs to the government .” '

That is just so wrong.
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#242 User is offline   barmar 

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Posted 2014-September-23, 09:17

View Postmike777, on 2014-September-23, 01:33, said:

But one must present the contrary or at the very least evidence that shows the true life of the entrepreneur. Barton Hamilton of Washington University shows the harsh the very harsh life of the entrepreneur. They earn 35% less over a ten year period than those in a paid job, they fail often, they take far more risk.

All the more I suggest to praise them, they fail often.

Reminds me of venture capital financiers. They expect something like only 10% of the companies they fund to succeed, and either be acquired or have an IPO, so that the VC can make a profit on them. The mitigate the risk by funding lots of companies -- the few windfalls make up for all the failures.

But individual entrepreneurs don't have the law of large numbers to save them. If you're one of the 90% who fail, you probably lose everything unless you're already wealthy.

#243 User is offline   PassedOut 

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Posted 2014-September-23, 20:19

View Postblackshoe, on 2014-September-23, 09:05, said:

'The government had the right to demand 99 percent of a man’s property, the Vermont representative thundered. If the nation needs it, “the property of the people . . . belongs to the government.” '

That is just so wrong.

I certainly agree. To avoid making extreme statements like that, today's politicians have handlers. B-)

In the same debate, some democrats argued just as strongly that the government had no right to a citizen's property. Of course, all rights are just what we define them to be, and taxation was increased.

The founding fathers were compromisers, as they had to be to form a union of free and slave-holding states. The 3/5 of a person compromise was anathema to many on both sides, but was the only way to unite the states. Over time, human rights have been redefined over and over, generally in a positive direction.
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#244 User is offline   blackshoe 

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Posted 2014-September-24, 00:46

The government giveth, and the government taketh away. Blessed be the government.
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#245 User is offline   PassedOut 

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Posted 2014-September-24, 04:55

View Postblackshoe, on 2014-September-24, 00:46, said:

The government giveth, and the government taketh away. Blessed be the government.

That's why you want a government "of the people, by the people, and for the people."
The growth of wisdom may be gauged exactly by the diminution of ill temper. — Friedrich Nietzsche
The infliction of cruelty with a good conscience is a delight to moralists — that is why they invented hell. — Bertrand Russell
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#246 User is offline   kenberg 

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Posted 2014-September-24, 05:39

Life is sometimes seen as a conflict between the morally right and the morally wrong. It is sometimes seen as a matter of choices, preferences and power. When it comes to the right/wrong approach, a distinguishing feature is that people seldom change their minds. We can speak of taxation, or of war, or of helping child immigrants, or of abortion, any of these. The moral decision is seldom open to argument.

When we take the second approach to taxation, government clearly has the power to tax. The proof is that they do tax and no oe is stopping them. I also favor taxation, I fav or progressive taxation, I don't favor 99% taxation or anything like it. Although an emergency can be an emergency.

A word about entrepreneurs. I don't think any of us think of "entrepreneur" as a vile epithet. It's a matter of getting it right. Let's go again to TR. I don't have the script handy but TR was quoted as saying something like" A man might not have any cards to play, or he might play them badly. We cannot help with that. But we can make sure that the game isn't rigged against him". That's the tone, if not the exact words. At the time he was speaking, a small number of people had sufficient power frm their own entrepreneurship that any new entry into the area could quickly be run into the ground. TR's idea (my summary) was that to encopurage entrepreursjip you had to control entrepreneurship. Sounds right to me. Now later FDR was far more inclined to help people get a deck of cards in the first place, and we have carried on with that. Not always wisely I think, but still the idea gets my approval.
Ken
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#247 User is offline   kenberg 

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Posted 2014-September-24, 07:23

It is always high risk, maybe make that insane, for a male to bring up single motherhood. But we are discussing poverty, and they are related. Here is a link.

http://www.washingto...=nl_opin&wpmm=1
Ken
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#248 User is offline   PassedOut 

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Posted 2014-September-24, 08:01

View Postkenberg, on 2014-September-24, 05:39, said:

Life is sometimes seen as a conflict between the morally right and the morally wrong. It is sometimes seen as a matter of choices, preferences and power. When it comes to the right/wrong approach, a distinguishing feature is that people seldom change their minds.

Yes. Folks don't like to argue directly that, "People should do as I say."

It's more acceptable to claim, "This is god's will," or, "These rights are absolute." But the real intent of statements like those is, "People should do as I say."
The growth of wisdom may be gauged exactly by the diminution of ill temper. — Friedrich Nietzsche
The infliction of cruelty with a good conscience is a delight to moralists — that is why they invented hell. — Bertrand Russell
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#249 User is offline   PassedOut 

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Posted 2014-September-24, 14:56

View Postkenberg, on 2014-September-24, 07:23, said:

It is always high risk, maybe make that insane, for a male to bring up single motherhood. But we are discussing poverty, and they are related. Here is a link.

http://www.washingto...=nl_opin&wpmm=1

I won't risk getting into the main issue either, but I am surprised that IUDs aren't more in use. My first wife, who believed most emphatically that she should not bring children into a world like this, used an IUD decades ago with no problems.
The growth of wisdom may be gauged exactly by the diminution of ill temper. — Friedrich Nietzsche
The infliction of cruelty with a good conscience is a delight to moralists — that is why they invented hell. — Bertrand Russell
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#250 User is offline   blackshoe 

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Posted 2014-September-24, 17:56

View PostPassedOut, on 2014-September-24, 04:55, said:

That's why you want a government "of the people, by the people, and for the people."

Yeah, we tried. Doesn't seem to be working out all that well.
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#251 User is offline   mike777 

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Posted 2014-September-24, 23:17

Speaking of fighting poverty. My local eye doctor has been arrested for writing drug scripts.

This guy and his fellow eye doctor brother in my local town just arrested.


Somehow I was not surprised or in shock. I think last year I got a horrible bad flu from his staff. This is the guy who keeps telling me I need eye surgery the last few years and I put it off. He may be right about my needing eye surgery but his whole operation seemed off. To be fair over decades and decades going to the eye doctor seemed off tilt. I really have never been happy with any one of them over the years.


I went to him because the other eye doc I went too seemed worse, and his office was very near. As I get older I guess location starts to trump.
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#252 User is offline   kenberg 

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Posted 2014-September-25, 07:44

I see your point. If we are to solve the problem of poverty we must first see the problem clearly. Crooked and badly trained ophthalmologists are the root cause of all our troubles. Who wudda thunk it?
Ken
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#253 User is offline   Winstonm 

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Posted 2014-September-29, 06:23

I just returned from a 15-day trip to southern Italy. My eyes seemed to work fine during the trip but now I wonder - should I have allowed that entrepreneurial street vendor in Napoli to do laser surgery for the 15 euros? Who loses the most if he fails?
"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." Black Lives Matter.
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#254 User is offline   kenberg 

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Posted 2014-September-29, 07:06

View PostWinstonm, on 2014-September-29, 06:23, said:

I just returned from a 15-day trip to southern Italy. My eyes seemed to work fine during the trip but now I wonder - should I have allowed that entrepreneurial street vendor in Napoli to do laser surgery for the 15 euros? Who loses the most if he fails?


You have to bargain. Probably he would have done it for 10.
Ken
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#255 User is offline   Winstonm 

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Posted 2014-September-29, 08:48

View Postkenberg, on 2014-September-29, 07:06, said:

You have to bargain. Probably he would have done it for 10.


I don't know....bartered laser eye surgery....maybe in Matera, but Naples?
"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." Black Lives Matter.
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#256 User is offline   pilowsky 

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Posted 2021-March-12, 01:35

Bridge as an inverse index of global poverty.
I just downloaded this from ourworldindata.
My link
Since the introduction of Bridge, countries, where it is popular, all show dramatic decreases in poverty.
Countries were selected based on BBO's data about where their advertising comes from, and my own guesses.
non est deus ex machina; även maskiner behöver lite kärlek, J'ai toujours misé sur l'étrange gentillesse des robots.
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