[Jinksy]

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MP pairs. What's your next call? Do you agree with the bidding so far? Also, what, in the abstract, do you think you've shown by having bid this way?

[Cyberyeti]

Jinksy, on 2016-August-26, 17:54, said:

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MP pairs. What's your next call? Do you agree with the bidding so far? Also, what, in the abstract, do you think you've shown by having bid this way?

You've shown a hand too good to overcall 2♥ and too good to X then bid 2♥.

For me this is an X then 2♥, but our simple overcalls can be a lot better than most peoples', make the hearts AJ5432 and we'd prob just overcall 2♥.

Can a slam be on, of course, Kxxx, x, Kxxx, Q108x might even make 7♣ given that all 11 points are most likely on your right.

I think I'd bid 4♣, but easier if you can bid 3♣ over whatever partner bids over a 2♥ rebid (quite likely 2N).

[Jinksy]

Cyberyeti, on 2016-August-26, 18:11, said:

You've shown a hand too good to overcall 2♥ and too good to X then bid 2♥.

For me this is an X then 2♥, but our simple overcalls can be a lot better than most peoples.

Would X then 2♥ be forcing for you in this auction?

[Phil]

Easy 4C.

[neilkaz]

So much playing strength. I'll make a try for slam with 4C and hopefully PD reads this as a 4 card suit. I'll respect a 4♥ sign off.

[mr1303]

4C must be right now. The difficult question is what we do afterwards. You aren't going to make 6nt on power, so you need a fit. Unless you can get a club raise you have to settle for game I think. So I will raise 5C to 6C but leave 4H.

[SteveMoe]

4♣. 1N shows partner isn't broke. If they have 3 cover cards we are in business.

[The_Badger]

hi Jinksy,

Just put that hand into Kaplan & Rubens hand evaluator and it comes out at a whopping 25.55!

Steve Moe says 4♣. 1N shows partner isn't broke. If they have 3 cover cards we are in business.

However, given your own strength (and that an opponent has opened), what concerns me is that partner may be a little under strength for his 1NT bid, certainly not 8-10. He has been forced to bid and chose the lesser of two evils by discarding a very weak 4 card minor suit bid in favour of 1NT.

But I'm bidding 4♣ like many others, yet will proceed with a degree of caution. The hand could be quite distributional - you already know partner has a singleton ♥.

Please give us the whole hand, Jinksy, in a day or two's time as I am curious, perhaps like many others. Thanks

[alok c]

Pass. Partner is not expected to hold more than 5/6 pts,his 1nt call was forced.Normally he would have passed 3♥ but his 3nt call indicates he may have ♥Q.

[spotlight7]

MP pairs. What's your next call? Do you agree with the bidding so far? Also, what, in the abstract, do you think you've shown by having bid this way?
[/quote]


I like the X and 3H bid.


Bidding 1N in reply to a TO X does have higher standards in my style.

How often do you make 1N opposite a 1444 minimum hand with the values suggested that responder will hold here?


My overcall range is @12-17/18 for a 2H overcall, so X and 2Hs would show @17/18+HCP with quality HCP and/or extra shape.



With a random BBO player, I would pass 3N here. I am too likely to get passed out in 4C or have partner bid 4Ds now to now show a 5 card D suit.

[chasetb]

1.) Because of our point value and the 6-card suit, I think X followed by 3♥ is perfectly fine. Now I bid 4♣, this shows 6+ hearts, 4+ clubs, and at least a King more than minimum. I doubt 6♥ is there, but I won't give up on 6♣ so easily, and my suit is good enough to get dropped in 4♥.

[MrAce]

chasetb, on 2016-August-27, 02:26, said:

1.) Because of our point value and the 6-card suit, I think X followed by 3♥ is perfectly fine. Now I bid 4♣, this shows 6+ hearts, 4+ clubs, and at least a King more than minimum. I doubt 6♥ is there, but I won't give up on 6♣ so easily, and my suit is good enough to get dropped in 4♥.

Are we all sure that 4♣ shows clubs after we already bid 3♥? How would you bid with

A
AKQTxxx
xx
AKQ

Pd can hold

KJxx
xx
QJx
Jxxx

or

KT9x
xx
Axx
Jxxx

I do not know others but to me 3♥ is a 1 suiter hand and already self confirms the trumps, especially over a NT response. Perhaps we should have started 2♥ the previous round, which I would have.

You all should consider playing DBL and then new suit over NT response as forcing. Especially if your overcalls are made to 17 hcp, dbl and then suit over NT response should be forcing. 1 NT response is not 0-9 like other responses.

[Cyberyeti]

alok c, on 2016-August-27, 01:42, said:

Pass. Partner is not expected to hold more than 5/6 pts,his 1nt call was forced.Normally he would have passed 3♥ but his 3nt call indicates he may have ♥Q.

1N is something like 7-10 here, you bid a suit with less.

[Cyberyeti]

Jinksy, on 2016-August-26, 18:18, said:

Would X then 2♥ be forcing for you in this auction?

Over 1N (7-10 ish) it's game forcing for us, not over other minimum bids.

[msjennifer]

Partners 1NT followed by 3NT shows life.4H or 5 C must certainly be on.Hence I bid 4C.

[ggwhiz]

Jinksy, on 2016-August-26, 18:18, said:

Would X then 2♥ be forcing for you in this auction?

Not for me but it does show a very good hand. Nothing wrong with 3♥ on your auction but should tend to be the boy band, one direction.

A 2♠ bid over 1nt might work better in that partner can show shape type stuff and you can bid whatever you choose slowly, clearly on a game force. Mind you in my partnership a 1nt response is NOT a piece of cheese, you have to bid a suit, even a 3 carder with less than 8ish.

[Phil]

MrAce, on 2016-August-27, 02:40, said:

Are we all sure that 4♣ shows clubs after we already bid 3♥? How would you bid with

A
AKQTxxx
xx
AKQ

snip

A AKQTxxx xx AKQ is a 4S call after 3N. But maybe A AKQJxx xxx AKQ expresses your point better.

I would play 2H as forcing (but not 2m). 3H just says I am not worried about trump.

[MrAce]

Phil, on 2016-August-27, 16:05, said:

A AKQTxxx xx AKQ is a 4S call after 3N. But maybe A AKQJxx xxx AKQ expresses your point better.

I do not even understand what you tried to say. As you suggested I also play 3♥ means "do not worry about trump" Which makes next bids control.

Hand 1 makes slam opposing a ♦ control. Hand 2 does not. Hand 2 needs more than ♦A or KJx even if you guess right.

If what you tried to say was AKQTxxx suit is not solid, vs a 1 NT response, I will take it on any given day.

[Cyberyeti]

MrAce, on 2016-August-27, 21:20, said:

I do not even understand what you tried to say. As you suggested I also play 3♥ means "do not worry about trump" Which makes next bids control.

Hand 1 makes slam opposing a ♦ control. Hand 2 does not. Hand 2 needs more than ♦A or KJx even if you guess right.

If what you tried to say was AKQTxxx suit is not solid, vs a 1 NT response, I will take it on any given day.

The hand with the doubleton is safe at the 5 level, the one with xxx isn't.

It's a lot easier if 2♥ is forcing, then 2♥/3♣ is clubs, 3♥ sets hearts and then 4♣ is a cue.

[MrAce]

Cyberyeti, on 2016-August-28, 03:01, said:

The hand with the doubleton is safe at the 5 level, the one with xxx isn't.

It's a lot easier if 2♥ is forcing, then 2♥/3♣ is clubs, 3♥ sets hearts and then 4♣ is a cue.

And what did you think I said about 2♥ being forcing and about 3♥?

And what does 5 level have anything to do with it? Just because Phil said hand 1 should bid 4♠ over 3 NT? You will always be in danger with xxx ♦ at 5 level. I would probably sign off with xxx♦ hand. Because I need KQJ(x) ♦ to make slam. K alone is not enough. KQx is not enough due to being in front of the opener. What will Phil do when pd bids 5♦? It can not be ♦ A and I will explain why.

Assuming that you, Phil and me are on same page about the meaning of 3♥, you are way too focused on looking at the strong hand types and missing to see the ocean on the boat. You do not pay attention to what pd did or did not do. What do you think 3 NT over 3♥ means when you told pd that we will play at least 4♥? Please don't tell me choice of games! That means pd does not have first round control in any of the other suits. That also means he has something useful in at least one of the other suits or he would have simply bid 4♥ over 3♥ with nothing.

KQJx
xxx
Qxx
xxx

Would bid 4♥ over 3♥

KJxx
xx
Axxx
xxx

Would bid 4♦ over 3♥

KJxx
xx
Kxxx
Jxx

Would bid 3 NT over 3♥. Then you bid 4♣, he bids 4♦ you now bid 4♠ and he bids 5♥. You do not want to play slam xx vs Kxxx when the opener is behind that K. With KQxx ♦ pd would bid 5♦ over 4♠. That does not mean AK♦, he already denied A of ♦ over 3♥ by bidding 3 NT.

All you need is a pd who understand what "setting the trump" means and can use 3 NT as a tool instead of choice of games AFTER you already told him/her which game we will play, if not slam.