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Robot bidding

#1 User is offline   D13WE08 

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Posted 2021-January-08, 13:46

Hello, I bid 1club with 12pts, west passed, my partner robot (north) bid 1Heart, east bid 1nt then west bid 2 spade and my robot (north) doubled with 9pts. Can anyone explain why my partner robot bid Double here(I am unable to attach photo). We couldn't defeat the opposition and ended losing even more points 670. I couldn't overrule the robot so couldn't prevent its bid. Can anyone explain this to me please ?
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#2 User is offline   Stephen Tu 

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Posted 2021-January-08, 15:16

Most low level doubles on the first couple rounds of the auction these days are played as takeout, or "I have a good hand and want to compete more but I don't have a clear bid to make at this turn, pick something reasonable pard". It's only very rare specific sequences where double means "I want to double the opponents and expect to set their contract". Most actual penalties are collected when partner makes a takeout or value showing double, and you or partner has a trump stack and passes the takeout/action double. If you hover the mouse cursor over your robot partner's double, you should get a little bid tip that pops up which suggests what it is showing. Most of the time you should assume takeout and take it out.


That said, the robots have a lot of bugs in them and will sometimes come up with doubles with hands where it really shouldn't (should pass or take some other bid), or have weird definitions for the double that don't make much sense (be wary of its "2+" doubles where it is showing 2+ trumps in the opponent's suit; these are very random. Most low level doubles really ought to be "2-", takeout oriented, or "4+" I want to penalize. But the bot has undefined/poorly defined doubles in a lot of competitive sequences.) Your only solace is that others playing with bots are running into the same bugs and are facing the same problem.
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#3 User is offline   D13WE08 

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Posted 2021-January-09, 06:17

View PostStephen Tu, on 2021-January-08, 15:16, said:

Most low level doubles on the first couple rounds of the auction these days are played as takeout, or "I have a good hand and want to compete more but I don't have a clear bid to make at this turn, pick something reasonable pard". It's only very rare specific sequences where double means "I want to double the opponents and expect to set their contract". Most actual penalties are collected when partner makes a takeout or value showing double, and you or partner has a trump stack and passes the takeout/action double. If you hover the mouse cursor over your robot partner's double, you should get a little bid tip that pops up which suggests what it is showing. Most of the time you should assume takeout and take it out.


That said, the robots have a lot of bugs in them and will sometimes come up with doubles with hands where it really shouldn't (should pass or take some other bid), or have weird definitions for the double that don't make much sense (be wary of its "2+" doubles where it is showing 2+ trumps in the opponent's suit; these are very random. Most low level doubles really ought to be "2-", takeout oriented, or "4+" I want to penalize. But the bot has undefined/poorly defined doubles in a lot of competitive sequences.) Your only solace is that others playing with bots are running into the same bugs and are facing the same problem.


Thanks Stephen,
My partner robot only had 1Spade. you're right they have bugs or at least behave strangely at times. Also hoveriing over the bid often tells a lie, eg 11 to 19 points and when game opens up they often only have 6 or 7pts. Surely there should be an override situation for the human player when in a tournament!
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#4 User is offline   Stephen Tu 

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Posted 2021-January-09, 09:34

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Surely there should be an override situation for the human player when in a tournament!

That's not really practical, it would be against the spirit of bridge. We aren't supposed to be able to see our partner's hand and adjust to the contract we want to be in after the fact. Essentially you are asking to change partner's bid and maybe your own subsequent bids after the auction is over, which would be a different game altogether. Just think of the robot as another imperfect human partner. When we play with human partners, even good ones, occasionally they make what we think are nutso bids that we would never make, or they interpret bid meanings in some way totally different to how we think, and we end up somewhere ridiculous. It's just the same situation here, you just have to deal with it.

In a robo-tourney the robots will make the same bid at every table if the humans are choosing the same bids for their own hand, so the playing field is level. If the robot makes some nutty bid everyone has to deal with it, if they are choosing normal majority bids in their own seat. So it's a fair situation, though it's occasionally frustrating.
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#5 User is offline   mycroft 

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Posted 2021-January-09, 16:02

When you sign up for a game, you sign up to play with your partner. In a robot game, you get GIB.

The winner of the game is the person who can carry their GIB the best, and that sometimes means not doing the right thing because GIB won't get it right. Same as if you were playing with random C player and you don't do something because he won't get it right.

Of course, sometimes it means doing the wrong thing because the opponent GIBs won't get it right either.

I do note that when there's a sitout filled by robots, they tend to come third in the average 10-12 table club game. So odd they may be, but they're not as bad as many make out.
When I go to sea, don't fear for me, Fear For The Storm -- Birdie and the Swansong (tSCoSI)
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