[Winstonm]

I say do what we did with the other drug - alcohol - legalize all drugs but put a minimum age of purchase - say 40 years old. Then we create drug courts for offenders under 40 - and drug courts have been proven to cost less and be more effective for drug problems than prisions.

[pclayton]

Legalization is leaking its way into society, especially with medical marijuana.

There are some areas of Northern California where you can pretty much smoke it anywhere you want. I'm hopeful it manifests itself into a positive, and that we just remove the 'medical' label, and it can be sold publicly.

I'll bet the price comes down too

[mike777]

The_Hog, on Nov 21 2006, 09:38 PM, said:

"As I said it is not a victimless crime. Would you condone your children or grandchildren being legal prostitutes?"

This must be one of the greatest non sequiters of all time. You logic is totally twisted. If prostitution is legal, then it is victimless. Even if it is legal, if both parties engage with no duress, then how can there be a victim? I guess you failed Logic 101!


"Germany has a somewhat similiar problem with all the young girls abducted in other countries and sold as young brides or sex slaves.

Of course selling very young girls is common culture practice in many countries."

As for those last two comments....Do you have any idea whatsoever what you are talking about without making blind assertions?

IF something is legal it is victimless? This is logic 101? Good Grief...go back to school and listen this time.

Good Grief cannot you not understand plain English?

Perhaps English is not your first language. Please look up the word duress. Billions of people do all kinds of things under duress that are legal everyday...it is called Life. Do you think people will not go into legal prostitution under duress, what fantasy world is that? People take drugs under some form of duress all the time.

Perhaps you do not have a family. You seem to think a spouse paying for a legal prostitute may not create victims in the family? Your actions, yes even your legal actions affect and hurt..really hurt other people.

As I said the current situation is terrible but making it legal when only worsen things....see alcohol. You may wish to keep alcohol legal but please do not say there are no victims or it is victimless.

Selling young girls is a very common practice all over the world. Most of the world turns a blind eye to it. In fact selling very young boys is not all that uncommon.

Just read the Looming Tower to see how common it is in many Arab countries for starters, not that they are alone.

[the hog]

"Good Grief cannot you not understand plain English?

Perhaps English is not your first language. Please look up the word duress. Billions of people do all kinds of things under duress that are legal everyday...it is called Life. Do you think people will not go into legal prostitution under duress, what fantasy world is that? People take drugs under some form of duress all the time."

Actually English is my first language, though I do speak 4 others fluently. The first sentence of yours which I quoted contains a double negative, so I can only conclude that English is not YOUR native tongue. Billions of people? Hmm - somewhat of an exagerration I'd say. I suggest you read some textbooks on elementary logic and law. I further suggest you provide factual evidence and not hearsay in a crude attempt to support badly phrased arguments.

[pbleighton]

"As I said the current situation is terrible but making it legal when only worsen things....see alcohol"

Mike, you never responded to my question: do you want to re-criminalize alcohol?

Peter

[mike777]

The_Hog, on Nov 25 2006, 08:17 AM, said:

"Good Grief cannot you not understand plain English?

Perhaps English is not your first language. Please look up the word duress. Billions of people do all kinds of things under duress that are legal everyday...it is called Life. Do you think people will not go into legal prostitution under duress, what fantasy world is that? People take drugs under some form of duress all the time."

Actually English is my first language, though I do speak 4 others fluently. The first sentence of yours which I quoted contains a double negative, so I can only conclude that English is not YOUR native tongue. Billions of people? Hmm - somewhat of an exagerration I'd say. I suggest you read some textbooks on elementary logic and law. I further suggest you provide factual evidence and not hearsay in a crude attempt to support badly phrased arguments.

Ya I used repitition to help you understand English.

BTW double negatives can be proper use in English but that is another story.

It is even proper usage in the foreign languages I speak.

You guys seem to think there are no third party victims to legal prostitution. I keep saying that but you do not seem able to comprehend it.

If you have evidence there are no third party victims to this being legal let's see it.
If you think the taxpayer is not going to end up being used that is naive.
btw birth control does fail, what are you doing about the babies and std's?
I assume records are kept and lawsuits for support can be filed? Do you really believe there are no victims in legal prostitution guys and gals?

Look up duress, yes billions of us experience duress almost everyday......but not legal prostitutes I guess or those that frequent them....

Peter I am not trying to be the moral police. I just am claiming there are victims to legal actions despite Hog providing no evidence that there is not.

I do not think making one harmful action legal is an argument for making other harmful actions legal.

I assume despite prostitution being legal there will still be a thriving illegal side to it. So what are we improving? Do you gals really think this will not create victims?

Please fill free to correct my hurried spelling and grammer got a movie to go see now.......family waiting...

[Winstonm]

Quote

I do not think making one harmful action legal is an argument for making other harmful actions legal.

There is no simple solution either way - IMO, to argue to forcibly on either side is an attempt to support a predetermined bias.

When you begin to factor in items such as cultures, mores, social costs, and such verses individual freedoms the arguments become difficult at best.

However, this is the interesting part of the forums to me in that it is not a debate society so we do not have to quote sources - it is an opinion forum where everyone is free (within reason) to express ideas that may or may not be widely supported.

From personal experience, the areas that had legalized prostitution (outside Clark County, Nevada) had less sex-health-related problems than those areas that outlawed prostitution (within Clark County, Nevada).

From my own viewpoint, if a 21-year-old single woman is willing for a sum of value to exchange sex with a single 21-year-old man I do not see how there is a victim. It is only extrapolation from this basic premise that provides a victim.

To me it seems we Americans have an affinity for transference of our moral ideology onto the rest of the world as if ours is the only ideology that can be right and everyone else should be able to see that truth as clearly as we; however, we seem to keep running into problems with cultures and belief systems as strong as our own whose proponents believe just as sincerely in the rightness of their causes.

I know I have more than enough on my hands trying to get myself through each day without the added burden of trying to right everyone else's errors - perhaps if as a nation we adopted this "live and let live" policy and took care of our own business the world would not seem so threatening.

[the hog]

You are spot on Winston.
Actually I do have a good deal of evidence to support my view, however I did not wish to bring it up as it is anecdotal evidence. However this is as least as valid as the appeals to authority of text books.
I have spent the last 12 months living in Thailand, and I can guarantee that prostitution here does indeed fall into the ambit of "victimless".

Mike from the tenor of your posts I can only conclude that you are very young - late teens or perhaps early 20s. That would explain but not excuse your naivetyI suggest you get some experience in life before you make sweeping statements supported only by broad general references to books. I can refer you to boks that can argue anything you like , if you wish. That does not mean that they are correct.

[mike777]

I admit I have not been to Thailand in many years..I admit my close family has not visited in the past few years. My Dad almost married a thai but her mom objected......need I say more


When I was there prostitition(sp) was horrible as bad and painful as anywhere in the world. Third party victims..galore...ok...if no victims..now.... in Thailand i am convinced...

It was the pedophile capital of the world the last I understood...You may have better numbers....now....

[the hog]

Paedophelia has been virtually eliminated by an intense crackdown of Thai authorities.