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What to respond? Playing 2/1
#1
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Posted 2008-December-11, 10:32
Partner opens 1♥
#2
- Vesuvius the Violent Volcano
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Posted 2008-December-11, 10:36
1♠ for me. This hand is being played in 3NT or 4♥, unless partner has extras, which he can now show.
Yay for the "Ignored Users" feature!
#3
- mmm Duvel
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Posted 2008-December-11, 10:53
1♠ wtp?
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#4
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Posted 2008-December-11, 10:53
2♣ I am good enough to show the spades later if I have to this puts us in a forcing auction with the most room to figure out where we need to be. Showing where I live.
All IMO. Junior wanting to soak up all the knowledge he can.
#5
- hooked
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Posted 2008-December-11, 10:55
1♠, next question?
"And no matter what methods you play, it is essential, for anyone aspiring to learn to be a good player, to learn the importance of bidding shape properly. MikeH
"100% certain that many excellent players would disagree. This is far more about style/judgment than right vs. wrong." Fred
"Hysterical Raisins again - this time on the World stage, not just the ACBL" mycroft
"100% certain that many excellent players would disagree. This is far more about style/judgment than right vs. wrong." Fred
"Hysterical Raisins again - this time on the World stage, not just the ACBL" mycroft
#6
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Posted 2008-December-11, 10:57
regardless of whether you bid 1♠ or 2♣ partner will bid 2♥, what now?
#7
- The Abbess
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Posted 2008-December-11, 10:59
If I start with 2♣, my next bid is 2NT.
If I start with 1♠, my next bid is 4♥.
If I start with 1♠, my next bid is 4♥.
The world would be such a happy place, if only everyone played Acol :) --- TramTicket
#8
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Posted 2008-December-11, 11:12
2♣, I'll go so far as to say I hate hate hate hate hate 1♠. I normally respond 2♣ to 1♥ with this shape when game-forcing anyway, but when you also consider that
- We about 50 stoppers in the minors
- We have some extra values
- The spades are completely terrible
then it's completely irrelevent to miss spades because 3NT will make as well. Meanwhile bidding spades has some huge downsides.
- It will cause partner to completely misevaluate if slam is in the picture, where spade shortness is great and Qxx is awful.
- It will possibly lead us to a bad 3NT if partner is short in spades.
- We about 50 stoppers in the minors
- We have some extra values
- The spades are completely terrible
then it's completely irrelevent to miss spades because 3NT will make as well. Meanwhile bidding spades has some huge downsides.
- It will cause partner to completely misevaluate if slam is in the picture, where spade shortness is great and Qxx is awful.
- It will possibly lead us to a bad 3NT if partner is short in spades.
Please let me know about any questions or interest or bug reports about GIB.
#9
- Brain Farts and Actual Farts Increasing with Age
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Posted 2008-December-11, 11:14
2♣, WTP?
After partner bids 2♥, I also assume that he has a possible five-card suit and that bidding spades might be a bad move. 2NT seems good as a next move.
After partner bids 2♥, I also assume that he has a possible five-card suit and that bidding spades might be a bad move. 2NT seems good as a next move.
"Gibberish in, gibberish out. A trial judge, three sets of lawyers, and now three appellate judges cannot agree on what this law means. And we ask police officers, prosecutors, defense lawyers, and citizens to enforce or abide by it? The legislature continues to write unreadable statutes. Gibberish should not be enforced as law."
-P.J. Painter.
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#10
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Posted 2008-December-11, 11:17
I dislike 1♠. I think it is bad bridge to bid suits like this when you know you are going to force to game.
Starting with 2♣ leads to a more flexible auction, doesn't lose spades (I play 1♥, 2♠ does not promise extras in a GF auction), and doesn't cause partner to misevaluate his spade holdings while keeping all strains open. The only downside is that I will have to bid 2NT after I bid 2♣, but this seems like a much smaller misdescription.
Starting with 2♣ leads to a more flexible auction, doesn't lose spades (I play 1♥, 2♠ does not promise extras in a GF auction), and doesn't cause partner to misevaluate his spade holdings while keeping all strains open. The only downside is that I will have to bid 2NT after I bid 2♣, but this seems like a much smaller misdescription.
If you want others to be happy, practice compassion. If you want to be happy, practice compassion. :)
#11
- Csaba the Hutt
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Posted 2008-December-11, 11:17
easy 2♣ bid
... and I can prove it with my usual, flawless logic.
George Carlin
George Carlin
#12
- hooked
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Posted 2008-December-11, 11:40
Doesnt 1♠ have the benefit of both deflecting a ♠ lead against NT and not fooling your partner about the shape of your hand? We'd look silly going down in nt when we have a ♠ fit.
"And no matter what methods you play, it is essential, for anyone aspiring to learn to be a good player, to learn the importance of bidding shape properly. MikeH
"100% certain that many excellent players would disagree. This is far more about style/judgment than right vs. wrong." Fred
"Hysterical Raisins again - this time on the World stage, not just the ACBL" mycroft
"100% certain that many excellent players would disagree. This is far more about style/judgment than right vs. wrong." Fred
"Hysterical Raisins again - this time on the World stage, not just the ACBL" mycroft
#13
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Posted 2008-December-11, 11:44
Hi,
1S, wtp.
After 2H, one adv. of the 1S response becomes clear
now, 2H now promises a 6 carder, in other words you
have found a fit.
Additionaly you also discovered, that partner has a min.
opener.
Those two information are not av. after a 2C response,
there may be better examples for the proposed 2C bid,
but this auction is an example, why it pays to bid 1S
Given those two informations: you show the fit and end
the auction, 4H, fall closed, bidding is easy.
With kind regards
Marlowe
1S, wtp.
After 2H, one adv. of the 1S response becomes clear
now, 2H now promises a 6 carder, in other words you
have found a fit.
Additionaly you also discovered, that partner has a min.
opener.
Those two information are not av. after a 2C response,
there may be better examples for the proposed 2C bid,
but this auction is an example, why it pays to bid 1S
Given those two informations: you show the fit and end
the auction, 4H, fall closed, bidding is easy.
With kind regards
Marlowe
With kind regards
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
#14
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Posted 2008-December-11, 11:49
jillybean2, on Dec 11 2008, 12:40 PM, said:
Doesnt 1♠ have the benefit of both deflecting a ♠ lead against NT and not fooling your partner about the shape of your hand? We'd look silly going down in nt when we have a ♠ fit.
Sure.
Another is, that we give partner max. room to describe
his hand.
With kind regards
Marlowe
With kind regards
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
#15
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Posted 2008-December-11, 11:50
jillybean2, on Dec 11 2008, 12:40 PM, said:
Doesnt 1♠ have the benefit of both deflecting a ♠ lead against NT and not fooling your partner about the shape of your hand? We'd look silly going down in nt when we have a ♠ fit.
For your first point, I'd rather reach the best contract than reach a bad contract and hope I fooled them along the way.
Your second point is generally good, but it seems just about impossible to imagine 4♠ making and 3NT not, given our terrible spades and solid minor suits.
Please let me know about any questions or interest or bug reports about GIB.
#16
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Posted 2008-December-11, 12:52
I also bid 2C, it is tough to construct a hand where spades plays better than 3NT. However, when partner is short in spades it is easy to get to a silly 3NT with 4H or 5m cold.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.
- hrothgar
- hrothgar
#17
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Posted 2008-December-11, 13:15
1♠, wtp?
wyman, on 2012-May-04, 09:48, said:
Also, he rates to not have a heart void when he leads the ♥3.
rbforster, on 2012-May-20, 21:04, said:
Besides playing for fun, most people also like to play bridge to win
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#18
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Posted 2008-December-11, 13:34
thanks for the support I was beginning to think I was in the vast minority. hanoi5 did you read any of the other posts here that detail what I (and others) see as "the problem" with 1♠. I wouldn't go as far as ken or maybe josh to say that it is easy or a "no problem" call, but I think the advantages are numerous.
All IMO. Junior wanting to soak up all the knowledge he can.
#19
- Andy Bowles
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Posted 2008-December-11, 14:21
han, on Dec 11 2008, 07:52 PM, said:
I also bid 2C, it is tough to construct a hand where spades plays better than 3NT.
I like a challenge.
KJ109 AKxxx xx Jx with diamonds 5-3 and ♠Q offside
J109x AKxxx Ax xx with diamonds 5-3 and the long diamonds with the three spades
But these are pretty specific, so I don't disagree with your and Josh's argument.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
#20
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Posted 2008-December-11, 14:32
I think it is really hard to construct a hand where 3NT plays worse than 4♠ and where you cannot get to spades after you bid 2♣.
"Gibberish in, gibberish out. A trial judge, three sets of lawyers, and now three appellate judges cannot agree on what this law means. And we ask police officers, prosecutors, defense lawyers, and citizens to enforce or abide by it? The legislature continues to write unreadable statutes. Gibberish should not be enforced as law."
-P.J. Painter.
-P.J. Painter.