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Precision nebul 1D rebid with 54/45 minors

#1 User is offline   Chamaco 

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Posted 2004-July-05, 08:30

Hi all,
I would like to have suggestions on the opener's rebidding style after a nebulous 1 Diamond opener.
We use 2C as traditional Precision (6+ clubs or 5+/4M)
We include in 1D the following:

- 13-15 (semi)balanced
- 4441 with diamonds
- real diamonds hands

I the "real diamonds" hands, also 54/45 in the minors are included and this post refers to this issue.
Is it advantageous to play:

1:1Y: ?
  • 2= guarantees 5 clubs(even with 5D), can be 5332 not suitable to 1NT rebid, or a 4D+5C hand
  • 2 = any hand with 5+D without 5 clubs (even 5D+4C)


Or do you prefer to play that
  • 2= any 54/45/55 in minors
  • 2 = diamond single suiter

"Bridge is like dance: technique's important but what really matters is not to step on partner's feet !"
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#2 User is offline   luis 

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Posted 2004-July-05, 08:41

Chamaco:

I'm very happy with what we play over our very similar 1 opening bid:

1: Natural or any GF hand
1: Natural 4+
1N: 6-10
2: 10-12 with 5+ clubs or balanced 13HCP
2: 10-12 with 5+ diamonds
2/2: Weakish 5-8 with 6+ cards in the suit.
2N: 11-12 Bal

After 1-1 (Natural or any GF hand)
1: 4, denies 4
1N: denies 4h/4s balanced hand
2: 9+ cards in the minors
2: Minimum 6+ diamonds
2: 4 card support, usually minimum
2: Three suiter, minimum, 4 card heart support
2N: Maximum with exactly 6 diamonds
3: Maximum 5-5 or better in the minors
3: 7+ diamonds and Maximum
3: Maximum, 4 and 5+
3: Spade splinter, maximum, 4
3N: Club splinter, maximum, 4

We continue with relays but natural bidding can be effective as well. After 1d-1h;1N we use 2c checkback, 2d transfer to 2h and 2h gf relay with 2s and 2n showing 6 clubs and diamonds with 4h respectively.

After 1d-1s opener rebids are very similar.

If you are interested in continuations or have questions just let me know.

Luis
The legend of the black octogon.
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#3 User is offline   Chamaco 

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Posted 2004-July-05, 09:01

luis, on Jul 5 2004, 02:41 PM, said:

Chamaco:

I'm very happy with what we play over our very similar 1 opening bid:

1: Natural or any GF hand
1: Natural 4+
1N: 6-10
2: 10-12 with 5+ clubs or balanced 13HCP
2: 10-12 with 5+ diamonds
2/2: Weakish 5-8 with 6+ cards in the suit.
2N: 11-12 Bal

After 1-1 (Natural or any GF hand)
1: 4, denies 4
1N: denies 4h/4s balanced hand
2: 9+ cards in the minors
2: Minimum 6+ diamonds
2: 4 card support, usually minimum
2: Three suiter, minimum, 4 card heart support
2N: Maximum with exactly 6 diamonds
3: Maximum 5-5 or better in the minors
3: 7+ diamonds and Maximum
3: Maximum, 4 and 5+
3: Spade splinter, maximum, 4
3N: Club splinter, maximum, 4

We continue with relays but natural bidding can be effective as well. After 1d-1h;1N we use 2c checkback, 2d transfer to 2h and 2h gf relay with 2s and 2n showing 6 clubs and diamonds with 4h respectively.

After 1d-1s opener rebids are very similar.

If you are interested in continuations or have questions just let me know.

Luis

I had started the original system with my friends choosing a similar scheme.

1D:
1H = natural or balanced gf
1S/NT natural
2C/2D = invitational+ 5 carder
2H/2S = strong JS
2NT = natural invitational
3C = invitational one suiter c
3D = preemptive raise
3H/S= splinter

I had borrowed the 1H gf principle from Viking Club, but did not want to use relays with friends, we are not ready for it.

--------------------------------------------------------------------
We play XYZ and XYNT convention: after 1D:1y:1z/NT responer has a choice
-2C = forces relay to diamonds which can be passed; if opener rebids he has an invitational hand
-2D = "normal gf hand"
-suit rebids or preferences = weak hand
-jump shifts/jump raises /jump rebids are picture jumps in strongly slam oriented hands
-jump to 3C is only weak jump bid (only possible Clubs signoff).
--------------------------------------------------------------------

In order to ease the life of responder opposite a 2C rebid (e.g. 1D:1M:2C), opener raises the major either with 4 cards or with 3 cards and a singleton if he has the 45/55/54 minors type hand.

A problem is the 1D:1H:2H sequence (does responder have H or not ?)
- 2S = GF relay without H responder bids 2NT with a bal hand and 4 H, 3m with 5 cards in that m and 4 in the other and 3 cards support, 3H with 4 cd support and a singleton, 3S 4 cd support no singleton, 3NT = 4333.
- 2NT natural invitational with 4 hearts
- 3C = gf relay WITH hearts, 3D = 3 card raise and 9+ cards in minors, 3H = 4 cd support and singleton, 3S = 4 cd support no singleton, 3NT = 4333
- 3D = gf hand with 4H, opener bids 3H wth 4 cd support. (not sure this is efficient)
- 3h = generic game try with 5 hearts
- 3S = gf, natural 54


However, this all is acadmic bcause we have eliminated the 1H relay.
It was not clear for which hand to use it: probably best used for balanced hands, but in any case the risk of forgetting was too high.

We still keep the 3-card raise though with minors-oriented 1D opener.
It helps the weak responder to avoid those situations where he is 4-5-2-2 (2-2 in minors) and opener rebids 2C and he does not know which minor is longer or to rebid his major: often u end in a 4-2 or 5-0 fit.
I prefer risking a 4-3 fit with a side singleton :)

Anyway this was the reason why i was considering to choose to guarantee a 5 card clubs suit by the 2 clubds rebid.
"Bridge is like dance: technique's important but what really matters is not to step on partner's feet !"
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#4 User is offline   cwiggins 

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Posted 2004-July-05, 22:21

Quote

Hi all,
I would like to have suggestions on the opener's rebidding style after a nebulous 1 Diamond opener.

luis, on Jul 5 2004, 02:41 PM, said:

Chamaco:

I'm very happy with what we play over our very similar 1 opening bid:

1: Natural or any GF hand
....

Are you asking: "what system of responses is best, regardless whether it is legal to play it?" Or are you asking: "what system of responses is best under the following convention regulations?"

The reason for the question: I think that the method Luis describes would be allowed under the superchart only.

The ACBL superchart permits a "non-destructive convention, treatment, or method". The method Luis describes meets that critirea.

It might be permitted under the midchart as a "constructive ... response" but that rule can be used only if a defense has been approved. Has one? If not, the the method described by Luis is not permitted in the midchart.

The method described by Luis does not seem permissible under the General Convention Chart.
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