[gambolero]

1♣ - 1♥ - P - ?
Can I introduce a 4 card spade suit here?
If not, what is your bid with something monstrous like AKQx/xx/AKxx/xxx?

[Zelandakh]

Hello gambolero and welcome to the forums! I usually play that a 1♠ advance is forcing for 1 round and can be a 4 card suit. If you do not play this then you are probably playing that a direct cue bid is forcing but does not promise heart support. That means that you can bid 2♣ with such a hand.

[wank]

what zelandakh said, but don't be surprised if partner passes 1♠ - even many very experienced players don't know what's forcing and what's not in response to an overcall, particularly at the 2 level where you can very reasonably play it different ways.

[ArtK78]

wank, on 2013-June-28, 09:04, said:

what zelandakh said, but don't be surprised if partner passes 1♠ - even many very experienced players don't know what's forcing and what's not in response to an overcall, particularly at the 2 level where you can very reasonably play it different ways.

The way you phrased this implies that 1♠ is forcing. That is certainly not true in standard bidding, and it is certainly not a universal agreement. Many (possibly most) players would play 1♠ as constructive but not forcing.

That doesn't mean that it is not right to bid 1♠ on these cards - partner will rarely pass. But unless you have an agreement that a one level advance of partner's overcall is forcing, then it is not forcing.

[shnk]

never mind

This post has been edited by shnk: 2013-June-28, 18:34

[gambolero]

Zelandakh, on 2013-June-28, 01:41, said:

Hello gambolero and welcome to the forums! I usually play that a 1♠ advance is forcing for 1 round and can be a 4 card suit. If you do not play this then you are probably playing that a direct cue bid is forcing but does not promise heart support. That means that you can bid 2♣ with such a hand.

Thank you, I like this: forcing and can be 4 cards. Bridge Baron says 5+ cards with 11+ points which seems incongruent with playing the cuebid as heart support. With one partner we had established the agreement that 2♣ shows heart support and limit+ values, 3♣ is a mixed raise, but we hadn't agreed on this spot! Funny how we have all these cool forcing and invitational sequences in non-competitive auctions yet this simple spot went overlooked. Since the overcall can be quite light (say 9ish points but always a 5+ card suit), what is a reasonable minimum for bidding 1♠ here? How about 2♦?

[Zelandakh]

The minimum for a forcing 1♠ is not so much set by the minimum overcall strength so much as the maximum. You want to have reasonable game interest - an 8 or 9 count would be a typical minimum. The requirement for bidding a forcing 2♦ is similar despite being a level higher.