[straube]

matchpoints, all vul

....................97
....................T84
....................AKQ
....................AKJ43
832....................................KT
void...................................KQJ963
985....................................J642
QT98752............................6
...................AQJ654
...................A752
...................T73
...................void

East opened (1H) 1S (3C) ?

The 3C bid was alerted as a weak jump shift. Before reading further, what would you bid as North and how should the rest of the bidding go?


At our table we've adopted a relay double which can serve as a negative double (when an unbid major exists which it doesn't here) or a weak raise of partner's major or a desire to drop partner in diamonds.
Partner chose a relay double, I bid 3D and he now bid 3H which is undefined. I got the idea that he wanted some direction from me, so I bid 4S which ended our auction. I suggested after the hand that a 3H bid by him
would not guarantee a spade fit as he was an unpassed hand, but it would usually show spade tolerance. Partner has a problem of extra values, no heart stopper and only two spades. Maybe there's no solution
to this but I thought it was an interesting deal.

[wank]

obviously north's got no option but to bid as he did, whatever methods are in use.

i think south knowing partner has a game force despite not having spade support or enough in the opps' suits to bid 3nt could make a slam try. however, it's not obvious there is one available without forcing to the 5 level - is 4 hearts a self-agreeing cue for spades or a strong hand with diamonds? tricky. perhaps the solution is for south to break the transfer in your methods. opposite a weak hand with diamonds or a spade raise, you have a pretty good hand and you must be expecting a club raise from opener so it would be helpful to show your extra shape.

off on a tangent, i detest weak jump overcalls. i'll mark this down as another would be victory for intermediate.

[mike777]

I will try 3h as a general cuebid, tell me more.
Expect to end up in 4s, missing slam very often at MP.

[Zelandakh]

I think I broadly agree with wank - the immediate 3♥ is a raise and double followed by 3♥ is the general game force. Your 4♠ pretty much shows what you have, a decent IJO. On a good day North might make a move over that but it is quite understandable that they did not. Indeed, even without West's 3♣ response I would be surprised if the majority of a normal field would bid slam on this hand, particularly at MP.

[SteveMoe]

If double is relay, then south has to be ready to reopen with a double when LHO is preempting and South is short. Have to pass and hope partner reopens with that double.

Might consider if relay should be on only when LHO does not preempt.

[straube]

SteveMoe, on 2016-February-19, 19:08, said:

If double is relay, then south has to be ready to reopen with a double when LHO is preempting and South is short. Have to pass and hope partner reopens with that double.

Might consider if relay should be on only when LHO does not preempt.

I think that's right. I actually think double should be penalty when they switch suits like this. We already play 2H dbl 3C dbl as penalty for a similar reason.

[mycroft]

I hate WJSs too, but they work when you are disciplined enough to only use them when "I heard you, we're playing here even opposite a misfitting 18" is appropriate. The reason I hate them is that people Just Don't stick to it, and it comes back to opener going "man, if 3NT makes..." or "a singleton and an outside card, and the major scores better than the minor, and we might even be able to take 10 in either suit..." If you know it won't (or you know when it will, say looking at AKx yourself) you can relax and let it ride (and blame partner if it's wrong).

QJ-7th and a void in partner's first suit sure looks like a WJS to me. And this time partner had his minimum opener and we actually, successfully preempted our opponents. Yea us.

[Edit: Argh, sorry Zel.]

[gszes]

In my case it happens to be easy since x of WJO is always penalty if there is no other major(s) available to bid. The very nature of WJO invites this kind of penalty x due to the sheer lack of power inherent with the bid. Creating a relay with at least 2 cases of probable overbidding (a weak raise or dropping p in diamonds and hoping there is a fit) just seems like a poor treatment). It seems wrong to pass and hope that the overcaller will reopen with x when the overcaller is much more likely to have extra distribution and not feel comfortable with the idea of penalizing the opps. If the opps can make these kinds of preempts w/o consequence you will get stolen blind. WJO like occurred here can indeed win boards so the idea I to try to make sure when they do not win outright they are slaughtered (very helpful at imps).

[Zelandakh]

Could the last few posters perhaps clear up whether they are discussing WJOs or WJSs as things seem to have become a little murky here. To clarify, the OP auction includes a WJS in competition and makes no reference to WJOs at all.