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3d = preempt
imps
Spoiler
cheers
Eagles
both majors
#1
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Posted 2016-July-18, 06:39
3d = preempt
imps
cheers
Eagles
"definitely that's what I like to play when I'm playing standard - I want to be able to bid diamonds because bidding good suits is important in bridge" - Meckstroth's opinion on weak 2 diamond
#2
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Posted 2016-July-18, 07:36
3♠ for me too. Though I don't hate 4♦.
It's close.
It's close.
“Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.” George Carlin
#3
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Posted 2016-July-18, 07:37
I don't agree with your spoiler that it is "pretty clear". However, I would bid 4♦ for fairly practical reasons:
It makes partner (the strong hand) declarer.
It put us in the best major.
It puts the doubler (the opponents' strong hand) on lead.
This all means that I would guess that we get a trick more than when I bid 3♠. And whether we go down 1 in 3♠ by me or down 1 in 4♥ by partner doesn't matter, but if we happen to be able to make our contract, then it does make a big difference.
The two biggest drawbacks of bidding 4♦ are that partner might
- get overly enthusiastic.
- make the wrong decision over their 5♦.
Those drawbacks are why I don't think it is "pretty clear", but I would bid 4♦ anyway.
Rik
It makes partner (the strong hand) declarer.
It put us in the best major.
It puts the doubler (the opponents' strong hand) on lead.
This all means that I would guess that we get a trick more than when I bid 3♠. And whether we go down 1 in 3♠ by me or down 1 in 4♥ by partner doesn't matter, but if we happen to be able to make our contract, then it does make a big difference.
The two biggest drawbacks of bidding 4♦ are that partner might
- get overly enthusiastic.
- make the wrong decision over their 5♦.
Those drawbacks are why I don't think it is "pretty clear", but I would bid 4♦ anyway.
Rik
I want my opponents to leave my table with a smile on their face and without matchpoints on their score card - in that order.
The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds the new discoveries, is not “Eureka!” (I found it!), but “That’s funny…” – Isaac Asimov
The only reason God did not put "Thou shalt mind thine own business" in the Ten Commandments was that He thought that it was too obvious to need stating. - Kenberg
The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds the new discoveries, is not “Eureka!” (I found it!), but “That’s funny…” – Isaac Asimov
The only reason God did not put "Thou shalt mind thine own business" in the Ten Commandments was that He thought that it was too obvious to need stating. - Kenberg
#4
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Posted 2016-July-18, 08:04
These types of hands come up often on Master Solver panels and they tend to show a clear sea-change in bidding philosophy. As a general rule, all of the younger panel members along with those that are still playing at the top level will tend to prefer the call that gets them to the best strain even if that might well put them a level higher than they would like to be. It is not so much that bidding game is clear so much as the strain issue. If we had to bid a major directly, I daresay most would prefer 3♠ to 4. However 4♦ offers a little of both and is what I would expect to be the majority choice.
(-: Zel :-)
#5
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Posted 2016-July-18, 08:08
The SJ Simon rule points to 4♦. Against that, opener is behind my partner. In deals with two strong hands, this positional advantage is often large.
In general when I am uncertain, I prefer to lose by overbidding than by underbidding. So 4♦.
But yes I think it is close.
In general when I am uncertain, I prefer to lose by overbidding than by underbidding. So 4♦.
But yes I think it is close.
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-gwnn
-gwnn
#6
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Posted 2016-July-18, 08:26
3♠
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"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"
"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."
#7
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Posted 2016-July-18, 08:26
3♠
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity has no such boundaries!"
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"
"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"
"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."
#8
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Posted 2016-July-18, 09:43
MrAce, on 2016-July-18, 08:26, said:
3♠
MrAce, on 2016-July-18, 08:26, said:
3♠
I think 6♠ is somewhat of an overbid.
Rik
I want my opponents to leave my table with a smile on their face and without matchpoints on their score card - in that order.
The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds the new discoveries, is not “Eureka!” (I found it!), but “That’s funny…” – Isaac Asimov
The only reason God did not put "Thou shalt mind thine own business" in the Ten Commandments was that He thought that it was too obvious to need stating. - Kenberg
The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds the new discoveries, is not “Eureka!” (I found it!), but “That’s funny…” – Isaac Asimov
The only reason God did not put "Thou shalt mind thine own business" in the Ten Commandments was that He thought that it was too obvious to need stating. - Kenberg
#9
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Posted 2016-July-18, 10:38
I thought 4D was clear
i guess the concern is partner has the big balanced hand and 4D drives us too far, whereas we can go 3S 4H since we just expect partner to go again
i guess the concern is partner has the big balanced hand and 4D drives us too far, whereas we can go 3S 4H since we just expect partner to go again
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#10
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Posted 2016-July-18, 10:55
Trinidad, on 2016-July-18, 09:43, said:
I think 6♠ is somewhat of an overbid.
Rik
Rik
Yea I know, my mouse has double click issues.
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity has no such boundaries!"
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"
"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"
"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."
#11
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Posted 2016-July-18, 14:48
I'm an old geezer, so 3 ♠ for me.
#12
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Posted 2016-July-18, 15:14
I think 3S puts too much pressure on partner to find a winning call - after all, you may have bid 3S on a hand with much less playing strength. I think 4D overstates the hand so I'm left with either 4H or 4S. I chose 4S.
"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere."
#13
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Posted 2016-July-18, 15:29
This hand only has 3 HCP. Only 1 diamond. Partner is likely to have 2 or fewer diamonds.
Whether we bid 3♠ or 4♦, LHO is likely to rebid 5♦. They do have half the deck and 10 to 12 diamonds.
Fear after 4♦, partner would expect this hand to be stronger.
Whether we bid 3♠ or 4♦, LHO is likely to rebid 5♦. They do have half the deck and 10 to 12 diamonds.
Fear after 4♦, partner would expect this hand to be stronger.
#14
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Posted 2016-July-18, 16:01
i also think it's pretty clear to bid 4d
#15
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Posted 2016-July-18, 16:15
I'm sold on 4♦
That said I have casual partners where this bid is unsafe as they will definitely bid to the moon.
That said I have casual partners where this bid is unsafe as they will definitely bid to the moon.
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#16
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Posted 2016-July-18, 17:45
eagles123, on 2016-July-18, 06:39, said:
- 4♦ UCB but it requires that the partnership rate getting to the right marginal game as more important than partscore or or slam. If you cue-bid with weak shapely hands, partner must be wary of slam-tries.
- 3♠ NF and should not over-excite partner,
#17
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Posted 2016-July-18, 22:55
3s seems clear how much worse could I be.
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Posted 2016-July-18, 22:57
mike777, on 2016-July-18, 22:55, said:
3s seems clear how much worse could I be.
2 hearts, 1 spade and the king
if we're not making game, the opps are probably making something
#19
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Posted 2016-July-18, 22:58
wank, on 2016-July-18, 22:57, said:
2 hearts, 1 spade and the king
Be not afraid...dont play partner for perfect cards
Dont play partner for worst cards.Not sure how you play partner for only 3 major suit cards on this auction but ok.
#20
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Posted 2016-July-19, 00:50
mike777, on 2016-July-18, 22:55, said:
3s seems clear how much worse could I be.
You could have 4 losers more than you have and a misfit for partner. That is a lot worse than what you have.
Rik
I want my opponents to leave my table with a smile on their face and without matchpoints on their score card - in that order.
The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds the new discoveries, is not “Eureka!” (I found it!), but “That’s funny…” – Isaac Asimov
The only reason God did not put "Thou shalt mind thine own business" in the Ten Commandments was that He thought that it was too obvious to need stating. - Kenberg
The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds the new discoveries, is not “Eureka!” (I found it!), but “That’s funny…” – Isaac Asimov
The only reason God did not put "Thou shalt mind thine own business" in the Ten Commandments was that He thought that it was too obvious to need stating. - Kenberg
3d = preempt
imps